Read this: IPL cricket , the end of The Lady magazine, Tech bro profile Nvidia boss Jensen Huang, impact of tariffs on TV and the s

Why would anyone want to steal a toilet solid gold toilet nearly 5 million stolen from a palace ruthless Robin and missing millions crime next door the Golden toilet highest listen first on BBC sounds BBC Radio podcasts from BBC Radio 4 this week as a huge media event no not special for the Indian Premier League with playerauctions live on TV we also talking to the British CEO whose pioneering Australia's effort to ban under sea.

Through social media will find out about Jensen Huang in the latest in our groceries and 140 years after the journal for gentlewomen launched.

The magazine is in administration the class of ID survive online so you're still be able to sort a new Butler when you need one will be talking about it all leisure in the show with the format editor Rachel Johnson wait that long Rachel hello.

Just quickly, what's your reaction to this news to hear that the classified the smaller survive but it was a bit like suddenly hearing bit smaller much-loved - stately home burnt to the ground something you thought you was going to always be there with being wiped from the face of Britain maybe maybe maybe we hit differently later in the show fantastic will look forward to that.

Please do stay with us, but we are going to start with Donald Trumps tariffs, which have been dominating the headlines ever since his so-called.

Someday on April 2nd today it's Trump's 104 percent tariffs on China which the Chinese responded to with a hefty 84% rate for a media perspective.

We've heard about share price Falls for the big tech companies like apple m and NVIDIA there's been less coverage of the potential impact of tariffs on the wider Media industry to discuss it or we're joined by Joshy David the BBC's deputy can nights and Max gold from deadline hello to both of you today job is your day every day, but yeah, there's been this new escalation of the tariff war.

How are you covering these new development my goodness it changes in this area 43 polite and I've done anything like this is not the financial crisis.

This is not covered.

This is a halt the Rulebook has been ripped.

Annalong weather the usual kind of pacing of them she got America say one thing as you said we're going to do this and thank you could feel sorry for his people at the border who have to recalculate actually applied the answer is difficulty surprised that you're even managing could spend 15 minutes with us because you must be on every outlet.

It is extraordinary said they jobs become other day and night and I thinking I think this is true of most newsrooms is that we've all seen quite difficult.

I'm so when you get a massive story like this.

We've I mean there is stretched and there is no quite frankly wondering what were missing because you just cannot keep up with what's coming out minute-by-minute all the various development and trying to explain to people what on earth is going on with bond markets and why they should care for example to go back to last Wednesday when Donald Trump announces terrorist when you were watching that did that feel you looked like he was approaching it very much as a meteor event.

Yes it felt.

That's that's some school card that games whatever you want to call it game show the horse racing odds whenever you want to call it was just a made-for-tv event wasn't it? When you saw that coming out but behind that was incredibly serious message that if you were a factory making trainers and Vietnam War horror a household in America planning how to your body is going to stretch things were going to change pretty rapidly and pretty drastic.

So you've got to somehow get over this isn't just numbers on a scorecard.

This is people's lives and livelihood and how or interconnected quite frankly president telling that story of the heavy lifting for us, but I think that sense of disbelief that we all had when we saw that was replaced variklio how on Earth do we impress on people not just the severity of the story but also huge uncertainties around it.

I just don't know really how does going to play out and what do you think is media strategy has been when it comes to promoting these ideas explaining the tariffs.

It's been.

Because you know when you hear from the president when you hear from those behind his hands behind the scenes to you.

Get that very strong message.

We have been taken off right we have made things the world is coming to take them they taking the job and now we get the good and this is not good enough and he's played that game of trying to put board a very simple straightforward, but one that really resonates with a lot of people what you don't hear that much of course is the opposite effect and how this is going to impact on prices and there's been a reluctance to engage with that and then it's behind closed doors.

There was a point this week.

I've lost track of days, but there was a point at which we didn't hear from him.

All that I think it was Monday we didn't hear from him until the evening when he suddenly popped up with Prime Minister from from Israel and the whole day the markets had been sliding but that is quite deliberate because he thinks it back now.

Let the others come to me.

I've got to be seen as unfair.

Interesting and obviously economics.

It's always complicated to explain but tariffs are particularly Complex in your job.

That's your it's your job to communicate their ideas and these complicated ideas to be but have you managed to come up with her and explanation of tariffs that we will understand.

I hope you have to be quite honest.

I'm not difficult for you you say they're not difficult for somebody who has to work with one of those agency has to calculate exactly how much more has to be paid, I'm good too good a lot of country and it can be complicated and that sense but for the rest of us quite frankly this is an extra tax that is applied to give entering the country and it is the boy that is important than that is liable for that extra tax right.

That's a simple as it gets so it's not the person who's making a selling the goods who actually pay it so to speak it's a person or

Company importing it directly and a longer chain.

There's a lot of different moving parts the company that makes it is it going to try and suck up some of those extra cost so lost them somehow so that they don't risk getting all of the consumer at the other end don't pick up the full bill so that's frankly all of this do this but of course.

What is the impact but also in this incredibly volatile environment for you and thinking of last week's story for example where they've started by putting out of toilet saying the White House was going to roll that was then picked on by cmbc the fall out with trillions of Dollars of trading on the back of it wasn't true just how do you see? What was your reaction to that and how do you see through all this information has become a story where we are having to relax s i s and just giving example you mentioned those news that are tariffs that Chinese and postman America I found out about those.

Floor manager in a studio, where are the sitting right and how does that work that form and just said have you heard that this is just popped up at which point you think I'm going to have to double check it which to be honest with you hasn't always been the case when these kind of stories are up as you say but we have things in this world of social media when you had developments like the one we saw a Monday they call it the 15-minutes of Madness when we had that but have been paused and then we will have to go and look at the original and go actually that's not all that person said at all and then the markets realised pre-match at the same time you saw and real-time then going back down everything takes double-checking triple checking and beyond at the moment.

So does that make you very even more it was normal totally because you know you have to absolutely have to get it right because it just about you know audiences also about people working in the market 2 may get the window what we're saying so all of this is incredibly sensitive and he knows this week.

We live or die by credibility.

A journalist and you have to make sure you get it absolutely right there are occasions on which you have to sometimes go with something and then he sometimes think that's exactly what was said and that's become very difficult indeed because it is happening across multiple time zones as well as multiple players not the usual chance of communication for that way and in many ways Donald Trump is an unusual president wonder how you approach for tracking what he says it's a constant job because there is fact-checking and there is a sessions that come out and kind of thing actually we know from looking at the textbook.

History books.

This is simply not true and you know we have all sorts of things that are close all these jobs for example and you know that that is not the case that actually has not happened and you were pointing to things which do not relate to the items of talking about so we're constantly having to sort of check that and say we're going to say this but not bad or that also affects what you can put on there which is quite unusual thing to say.

About the president but can't you be quite careful about the bits.

We choose and we put up the bits which I'm misleading when you're going to have to correct them all of us.

Take more time and effort which story like this.

We don't really have do it.

Just give me a ring when I let you leave, please stay with us for a bit longer, but how many outlets are you going to be on between now and midnight? I do I stop counting I think it's that anyway to sanity really is to stop counting and just sit back and enjoy because it is a fascinating time to be doing my job.

I feel very fortunate in that sent it is chaotic.

It is busy things go by the wayside including food and drink but at the same time it is exciting and quite frankly I unlike the media show most viewed as a step into you have no idea which angle of the story you're going to be asked about has a low level of jeopardy by keep you on your toes they closing the title of our program Media Sharon I do with please stay with you, but I do want to bring in international TV co-editor at deadline hello Max

Give us a sense then, will you when it comes to the media sector we know what kind of an impact tariffs will have on the sector or media and still playing out so it's been about a week or so obviously since the since the big tariff liberation Day and there is still some confusion around what the real main impact will be to start as there was good news in the sense that the tariff to clearly on goods not services.

This is a big question marks the day prior to liberation Day we've been asked to me so services would be a TV show or a movie for example so there's a little bit of a fear around the fact that you might be selling a TV show or a film into the States and have a tariff slapped on that which concerns that may still arise in the in the reverse.

There's obviously these discussions around the European Union applying potential tariffs on services in the other way around so that could be a big problem that.

Come down come down further confirm the down the line but in the interim as he has been reporting.

I'm sure in Great depth any industry is weakened by the current situation so the advertising industry and the advertising in the way that it relates to the broadcasters is something has come up quite a bit over the past few days said the likes of ITV and Channel 4 rely still very heavily in your advertising.

They're pushing further into digital advertising that will be hit by the tariffs in some way it might be company spending less on their marketing.

It might be foreign companies outside of the US to advertise less in the States in this entire ecosystem could get smaller which can be a big problem in an era when being a commercial broadcasters difficult it's been a very difficult few years especially covid-19 advert session anyway.

That's hit the Lights of ITV and Channel 4 and disc only worse and so there's definitely concern there that could then hit the Producers knock-on effects and so on and so forth.

Ok, Emma has also been an immediate reaction for some company so I'm thinking about the fact that Nintendo's delayed meal does of the switch to in the US but also that the tiktok and deadline has been extended just explain the impact because there was talk wasn't there that actually that was related to tariff the fact that Donald Trump has extended the deadline for offers and indeed.

Yeah tiktok has become this sort of unlikely battleground between the States and china hasn't this year in in a way that nobody might have expected if we were speaking about a year ago.

There was that very brief there was very brief time when tiktok was banned in the states for a few days in January and then it was reinstated as Donald Trump attempted to push that van further down the road in order for a deal to be struck so that bytedance which is the Chinese owner and former of tiktok could sell a majority of tiktok set to either.

Company or a company outside of China that was slowly being negotiated for the tariffs and I'm sure as we're speaking probably the terrace between the States and China have gone up again like even 10-minutes that is that has left that deal completely under threat so Donald Trump has now pushed it back by a further 75 days.

I believe and tiktok remains this interesting battleground Donald Trump seems not not a pose in many senses to tiktok United idea of people being able to generate their own content and what not use it on indeed use it on his street social platform and there is a part of him that really want it to be able to continue but then when China comes into the mix.

It is this complicated relationship.

They have so we'll have to see how that goes from here before about our analyses the potential impact that might mean for producers, so are you suggesting that Terrace could end up driving up production cost for the film and TV industry.

I think the doctor.

To be driven up quite significantly over the past few years, so there's a funding crisis especially around high-end drama and especially in the UK and to a lesser extent in Europe that's been done partly by the Americans partly by the streaming service is coming in spending a lot of money on content than being driven up the quality has gone up quite significantly cost for a cost for crew has gone up.

I don't think there's necessarily a fear that the tariff will drive up those prices what I think there is a fear around and this is actually certainly related to the brewing prior to the terrace is a Fiat around what I'd probably turn cultural protectionism so back in January J Hunt is the chair of the British Film Institute said she would turn buy some protection is language around Hollywood and what that really means is that she's worried that the streaming platforms are going to be encouraged to make less content outside of the States

Slowly over the past few years especially Netflix and to a lesser extent than the other streaming platforms.

They've slowly really built themselves into these local ecosystems in countries like France in Scandinavia Canada Australia and obviously in the UK as well.

We will see how successful adolescence for example has been over the past few weeks.

It's been a huge amount of investment in these countries have directives and obligations.

So they say to the American streaming services you have to make x amount of content per year you'll have to make x amount of hours or x amount of shows it might be easier directives and these feel quite under threat actually prior to the tariffs being brought in there a Beano directive for out by Trump's administration that has claimed that they violate American sovereignty.

This is something that we're going to be looking out.

I think quite a bit over the coming weeks and it's worth staying at the culture media and sport committee tomorrow is due to release a report with recommendations about how to support.

TV and film in the UK and we have previously spoken to both Peter kosminsky the director and also the producer Jane tranter about their ideas for this and that's everything from as you're disgusting there to tax credits.

We know that Donald Trump would not be in favour of that and then I guess the question is whether at this point with all of this going on tariffs and whether the British government would be minded to wake a 5% subscription la Vie en en streaming subscriptions.

It is very likely that tomorrow and that report get published by the culture media and sport committee.

It will recommend 5% streaming Levy so I was going to ask the streaming services to pay a small amount of their UK revenues into cultural fund I would imagine this is the sort of thing that might be coming.

It feels incredibly on Donald Trump to ask big American firm big private American firms to spend.

The UK cultural fund and like you said the tightrope that the UK is currently walking with us in terms of relations you struggle to imagine that is the sort of thing they want to bring forward to this point just to bring you back in before you let you go back into the fray of tariff reporting you mentioned at the top you cover the 2018 financial crisis does this feels similar in anyway? How have some really good question 2007/2008.

I was actually New York work for the BBC and Beth and Pregnant so to speak because I was literally having to run from studio studio in the middle of a of an American summer and I still remember when we first got shown by an economist various indicators same look at this the housing markets about to fall off the cliff and the same home disbelief with that when was trump said I'm going as both of those things came to pass of course, but what is fascinating is that then as now you'll be couldn't really see an end to it, then the big Warriors this is going to reach Main Street

It was quite welcome here.

We do not know how things are going to end.

What is fascinating this time around though is we have a much more digital media and that of course is our priority now and is faster the origins of the BBC the economy even though many people think it's complicated etc.

That is always towards the top of their interest for this regardless of age regardless of whatever they really want to know so for us.

There is almost more of a challenge this time round to make sure we get out the information people need to know quickly enough and that is challenging because of course newsrooms have seen resourcing tight budget.

So you know this is going to carry on who knows where it is and before you moved into the meeting you actually work as an economist in banking.

I keep thinking watching this this is must be an exciting time to be an economist whatever you think of what's going on.

This is something that hasn't happened 400 years.

It's really interesting the ones out is there a bit of that inside you does it give you a different one.

Does it give me didn't respect to guess? I will say condom is a bit like lipsticks and become really popular in times of Drive writing but we could bring a smile on your face, but no, it's fine.

I look at this and I think I can look at the Tate absolutely fascinating me a living through history, but I also know that can be very uncomfortable with some decade of globalisation.

We put used for certain pattern of things tipping things the other two doing now is going to have also other repercussions, but I've got to say as an economist, it's often an easier job than being an economic journalist right cos you're talking to your peers and you can talk in job and all you like talking about margin calls and the rest of it you throw me out pretty quickly and quite right.

I'm gonna throw you out not very well, but hope you don't let you go because you've got a lot of explaining to do across the rest of the BBC David thank you so much for coming and also Maxwell but thank you very much both of you.

Thank you.

Well now the cricket season has begun not only in the UK but also in India where the Indian Premier League is in full swing that some IPL theme music you can hear it is the world's biggest T20 franchise competition and c74 matches played across 8 weeks.

It's also a huge media event the broadcasting and streaming rights for 2023 to 2027 reportedly sold for almost 6 billion dollars and it was invented as a media spectacle inspired by Bollywood and the NFL Tim Wigmore is Deputy cricket Forest at the Telegraph and author of cricket Comics and he joined us to tell us more hello Tim just briefly I hate to say this because I'm sure lots of people listen will know but for those who don't describe what the Indian Premier League actually is how it works like a 2-month competition every year play between Indian cities will have teams at the 10 teams and I didn't eat.

Call Matt 1/2 hours and you switch on every night 7:30 Indian time and you'll have a game for you and it's very much.

I'm done is done as you said it was the American model of using entertainment with sport and it was founded in 2008 by that point did they found it the growth of the middle class in India meant? There was a huge untapped market for cricket and and it was very popular India but there's a limit to how much is that you can play just the team can't play everyday were you might get the national team playing a dozen games in a month in the IPL you can have 40 get into the month or so there was a real huge untapped market and and they decided in a people in India but why not can I copy the American model getting Premier League football get people to root number? I will Bangalore whatever and and they found them all those shoes market for the

Anthony people cheering for the cities and lettering for in a separate way as well, but it's always wins anomic context around its funding terms of ride massive rising TV and smartphone ownership was the key moment try to make a similar to 96 Quite get that the funding possibly this opportunity, but I think by stars and Indian economy is doing a lot better and and the TV rights cricket generally rocket and I think you had a feeling that you know all these cricket.

You know about three quarters of crickets revenue comes from from India Indian fans and I think the engine board felt this money around the world, but if you have her own competition.

That's really great and had all the best players coming from abroad that will be able to eat that money for ourselves and it kind of person different from that point of view.

Hollywood's involved can you just explain how it helps with the popularity of actors? This is one I have been involved in the group of teens and if you watch a game between over a painted them in the crowd and so is that real that link between boiling and I would say as the league has evolved and that links become less important as it was a sort of way the bottle connections away to encourage people to watch initially but now as there's trouble daughters have developed.

You don't need to give it's quite as much because the sport is selling itself really call me old-fashioned, but when it comes to sort of English cricket, I think of it Morris port and less entertainment, but is that not the case for the IPL is that very that's packaged as entertainment.

They had some stuff she came for an NFL teams to the package was came to America and

England 1/100 in England the tournament at three teams now you have private investment from the same owners who run the teams in India so you actually has now that is coming as well.

It's gone from America to India and now to England to which is that the sort of our network team stay with us, but I do want to bring in 2 mile Mills England T20 international was a former IPL player and tomorrow also have BBC commentators on sorry with brands you away from commentating on the ongoing goojerat Titans vs.

Rajasthan royals match.

Can you take a break from that happy to be here as always having a little break? When was the one day ones available when we giving you a break just outline for us then how different you played in both.

How did the IPL compared to the English leagues the IPL is it's the only place you can go with in cricket to experience is difficult.

Not being in IPL Stadium or an England vs.

India match for example, but yeah well that being in the stadium.

It is difficult to explain it is like an experience that you don't really get anywhere else and roll across really any any sport.

I know obviously we have some brilliant stadiums and football here in the UK or NFL in in America that it will College college football in the abbey Stadium but the pure love and the energy in The Passion that the Indian public have for cricket and particular individuals within cricket.

I think that's what makes it really unique is it was if you're in at the Stadium at cheaper in Chennai when MS Dhoni comes out to bat you won't experienced anything like it in World Cricket that passionate about a single men that they make it they make a noise like you can't imagine the barmy army.

Obviously they do a brilliant job, but yeah one man's trumpet doesn't quite Wharf

2000 people going going crazy for one one person and where the media says I'm interested really in the media side effects just how would you describe the level of Media Street near that you were under when you were playing it compared with here.

So yeah, it's items certainly I guess my my first introduction to it wasn't through the IPL but it was when I so just prior to the auction I toured with England in India we played a match T20 series and a head of the first game.

I was called for a press conference pre pre-match press conference that time I had one England Car Parts very very wet behind the ears.

I think I was only 23 years old and maybe 20 just done 24 and yeah, I sat down in this in this room at the same time in kanpur think it wasn't yeah.

It was a room full of bad memory 70 people maybe television cameras everywhere you being asked questions that you would.

Last anywhere in the world that there is a real kind of free-for-all in in terms of personal question a lot of the time you'll find that the and it still happens now and we'll have been in those rooms the the Indian Media of searching for clips and for snippets and particularly about Indian players, so you'll often find that will be doing an interview after a game that I've played really well in but a member of the Indian Media well.

Just ask me a question about the holy or something that's completely unrelated to the game that I've just played in or I'm going to play in because they know if they can they can just write an article on.

Holy MS Dhoni or one of these names it will just do huge numbers for them and it is very unique.

I wouldn't happen in England in another sport and you just mentioned the auction to tell me cos that I said at the top they had the playerauctions.

What is that what goes on the day to day events often so we won't have time to really go into the full Dynamics of an IPL auction but that's how the teams are built up so every every year you kind of you can release players and bring flowers back in but yeah, it goes to an auction process televised around the world and it is a physical so all to each team has a table in the room.

There is an auctioneer after an English auctioneers, then I moved maybe two more so some some indie auctioneers Richard Madeley has a very famous British auctioneer he did it for a long time.

So yes, I was very fortunate so as I mentioned the I went to India about literally 3 weeks before the auction and then I did really well for England against India in India and that was.

Feeding the big IPL auction for that year and it was The Perfect Storm moment for me in terms of I did really well.

It was televised obviously broadcast and then there were a few teams that needed a fast bowler at like myself and the other than I was in Dubai at the time and I sat in my bedroom and watched as I went under the devil on television ok, and now you've that pivot to becoming a commentator is it a help and a hindrance that you know players personally and you know what they're going through.

What's the experience of making that jump between a parent commentator like yeah, absolutely you can give him so I think ultimately you have to come back to always trying to remember where you there because there are so many commentators and presenters and analysts but I think I can offer is is that insight into a changing women? I'm still a current play.

I still hope to keep playing for a while longer.

Yeah, but yeah, you can be difficult trying to be honest.

Criticism of players that your friends with or that you're currently playing with or I've certainly adds quite a few instances, where I've been trying to get back into the England team and I've been commentating on England game and are your reticent obviously say bad things about them when you're trying to get back into that team on you so that I think my Nando's might be behind me now.

So maybe I can be a bit more confident in what I say tell the truth.

That's that's that's where it kind of you standing for with you need to you need to be able to articulate what you see and be fair and yeah give insight and give give give analysis into what you what you see from a players point of you or we're going to let you go back to thank you so much for coming on the programme was Tim with more and you can follow anyone is interested.

You can follow the Indian Premier League on BBC Radio 5 Sports Extra that's all the county championship matches on sports extra and the BBC Sport website and app now.

We're gonna turn to.

Latest tech pro series and the Man Mark Zuckerberg has dubbed The Taylor Swift of Teck Jensen wine is the founder of NVIDIA the company that produces the advanced chip the power AI is customers reported include open AI matter and Microsoft and it's been valued at more than 2 trillion-dollar well Steven Witt to the journalist and author of a new biography titled the thinking machine Jensen Huang NVIDIA and the world's most coveted microchip welcome Steven thank you so much for coming.

I listen you've described in videos product as the world's most coveted microchip.

Just explain for people listening.

What this microchip does so if you're on duty or similar system, can you put in a request request is taken your broadband with giant industrial data centre somewhere giant Warehouse full of Computing equipment and it writes.

Paper for you or it like turns you into anime apps or whatever you ask her to the process that request season video microchips actually do the Maths what is done it sent back to you, but does microchips Medina centre.

That's what they're selling it is enormously profit last one year $30,000 each ok, and this is the guy the person you've written about Jensen wine is heavily involved in all of this.

What do we know about his early life and how he developed a passion for computing was born when he was younger than it was 10 his parents.

Sent him to what they thought was a prestigious college preparatory school, but which turned out to be a reform school for juvenile delinquents, so it shows up to the place and the ground covering cigarette butts and his roommate has nice ones from a recent knife fight saying that they sent him there on purpose or they didn't know either.

Is that where we came across computing import with a couple of years later and came across the Apple 2 in the 1970s that begin with computing major did electrical engineering at this time the World computer science majors typically studied it from the circuits up rather than the screen down works because they were usually approaches now skilled microchip designer did someone paper and basically has done this episode.

She was 20 years old and he still doing a 62 years old and why then did he found in video originally what happened was the backstory originally return to make money off so they saw you know the 3D graphics controllers that we like playing Call of Duty or whatever they wanted to they wanted to render that as fast as possible and they saw market for a certain kind of customer who would install.

These chips in your computer's with engines and course it would build a whole computer just around this microchip.

So that begin with a successful industry, but terrified that they know be completed away was constantly looking for another application for the circuits and if I only found it with a i f you.

Yeah, I was going to say when did he decides the company to developing AI chips curry that was Eureka moment for 3D graphics was infinite no matter how well you render the characters in the game the game is always wanted more and better graphics and they're constantly looking for another application that had that scene profile and finally we discovered artificial intelligence the Manor House play me the computer in the mouse model became a what could do the users and customers just demanded more and more and more and this was a perfect fit for them to the company to know most full-time AI in 2014.

Basically would not on anyone's radar that was a very early back and then kind of all the di breakthroughs came along the company increased in value several hundred x automatically be coming through the single most valuable company as you there for a second cos I think it would be useful to hear Jensen home discussing what a I can do for us.

Let's have a listen if there is one thing to do is to go get yourself in AI tutor right away and that article of course just teacher things anything like help you programmed to help me write.

I hope you and allies help you saying I'll be a reason you're not all of those things is going to really make you feel empowered.

I think that's that's going to be our future going to become Superhumans not because we have super in Wigan become superhuman, because we have supereyes well that was Jenson wine speaking to Cleo Abram on her YouTube channel.

Steven what is his vision AI future we're going to become Superhumans with aib what specifically does he mean? What is a computer and then our actions will be manifested in the real world by a agents in robots and jensen's trying to position himself right in the middle of all of that he's training for robots right now to the point of rural bodies.

It's like science fiction accept it all real and Jensen doesn't even read science fiction you just building my stuff from the circuits are so he's going to connect with these visions of reality that science fiction authors that for a long time, but you doing it just from like your business your prologic and is he ever talked about ethical or safety debates around AI does he have concerns actually gets upset when you bring it up.

He thinks that these concerns are driven by data that the Rational and they're just kind of his dystopian science fiction visions that are realistic there.

I've everyone I talk to you and I use the most popular after mystic about a future you really think entering or she calls a new industrial revolution where data goes into a factories in intelligence cocktail and how are the big AI companies on and videos chips and and what impact it has on one's relationship with the likes of salmon and Mark Zuckerberg 100% dependant.

He's the most powerful man is essentially the only member of the hardware you know during the Gold Rush the guy selling the shovels and all the other companies in opening times of competition Google Facebook all that you know there was no competition it all controls 90% of the market for the most of these chips and production production takes place in Taiwan which is obviously very vulnerable to geopolitical changes from.

Paris to threats from China we were talking about Paris at the top of the program.

How does he navigate those hideous Abbey political operator you never talk about how she was actually a file Silicon Valley in Acapulco not to attend Trump's inauguration on this is a tremendous impact on it because everything in video of cells as many Factors in type 1 and doesn't suppliers so I'm quite significantly over the past few weeks as the shakes and you clearly know the guy very well.

You've written a biography about him being interviewed him.

X x what insights did you get into him and his relationship with the media? What was it like interviewing him compared with others for example, but it's always great.

He's very candid.

He doesn't you know the messages trying to get across you thinking out loud.

What is also quite elusive.

You really does not like to talk about himself at all the things.

I've learnt about Jenson is most Silicon Valley

Pretty clearly driven by ego is not the opposite himself up constantly constantly kind of walking in the mirror and telling himself.

He's not good enough and that he has to try harder and this is what motivates it's almost purely negative emotions you terrified him video going bankrupt even today.

Even one of the largest company in the world is totally terrified that some kind of competitors.

Shut up and destroy his company operates in a way that I would describe it, but it seems to work for him that you go your book Stephen with your biography the think Jean Jensen Huang NVIDIA and the world's most covered is microchip is out on Thursday thank you so much for coming on the programme now in November Australia will introduce it back under 16s using social media a world-first regular listeners might remember when I interview Bill Gates early this year the Microsoft found a told me.

There's a good chance the ban is a smart thing.

When it comes to that for me question of kids and tech all eyes are on Australia right now, but the company working on the software behind the van is British the Stockport based firm is called age check certification scheme and its CEO and founder Tony Allen is joining us Amsterdam when he's running a tech conference on the issue welcome Tony very well.

Thank you and what are these chips and why are they so, that's what my question? What are these chips the chips that you're using apologies for your software that you're trying or what's going on? Why is it so important? What have you got there? Be a sex education study.

We test the idea.

They check systems work.

So I'll role is to look at all the different vendors of providers out there and they put themselves forward as part of this Australia we are independently testing and sharing them and making sure that they actually work and then ultimate will produce a report for the Australian governments that about whether or not they can be trusted weather.

Privacy-preserving whether they actually do what they say on the and if they do work.

How do they work? What are they doing? There are broadly speaking when you look at a sharing the age of a you there are three ways you do that age verification where you find somebody's date of birth and you wherever that is a record of their driving licence passport bank where it is and then from my old age estimation where your allies in the features of humans that vary with age.

So I'll face gets older it gets deeper.

I haven't even change various other things and then I swear you find any other fact about somebody other than that date of birth and from that is reasonable to draw an inference that they may be certain age.

So if you have a mortgage for instance or if you are a commercial airline pilot.

Where do that fact is you can draw some inferences about their age and what influenced is a you drawing about the whether these products work and which which thing do you think of best?

We are looking at how this technology works here understands.

You say at a global conference that we run with this is more than 50 of these different types of technology here.

We look at the different biases how they treat different types of people made the Dead identity challenges in the Australian context in particular.

We get First Nations and indigenous populations and how we deal with those we make sure that they operate in a fair open way that people can understand was also they are preserving the privacy of users of preserving the security of their data because I used to just in there that a potential weakness might be the day.

Just wouldn't wouldn't understand wouldn't get it right that they wouldn't be able to tell from certain Communities whether you were under or over 16 what number is a fool proof that it's been illegal to buy tobacco for the last.

100 years children still get hold of it and the online world in the social media world children potentially still find ways around it so we look at the efficacy for not for me.

What are you trying to completely eliminate that problem but you are looking at trying to protect the biggest proportion of the population from the risks that have been identified ok? And I said at the Beginning you know all eyes are on Australia which they are but I wonder how much interest there is in what you're doing and is idea of banning under 16s and how the technology might work, how much interest is in that around the rest of the world.

I mean or other countries interested.

Are they talking to you? This is a global recession.

We've got hearing the Amsterdam at the moment.

We got Brazil Nigeria the Canada Australia the UK and and they're all a happy looking at the various things are going on in Australia the decision about what should children.

Access is a political decision and one thing I do have a little bit careful of is that there's an election in Australia at the moment so going to be careful what I say in an election seat and as you would anywhere but also there is an election in the UK going to tip of the wing of the British government come to you and said I'm looking at we're interested in this week.

We're looking at the 16th looking at the online safety actor who is coming into force as we speak they've gone so far.

We definitely know that the the new government here in the UK at the Labour government in you want to go further with the online safety legislation in the UK political question for a politician not for me, but but I know that hearing.

I'm so we've got the UK regulators Ofcom the information commissioner's office we also got the Brazil France and Germany all of them are looking at these conditions.

Australia is the first to go for this countrywide basis already of the US you've got statewide legislation in Florida and in other states in the US starting to introduce these kind of restrictions of controls children's access to social media.

Ok, thank you very much.

I'll let you get back to your conference now, but will definitely come back to this in the summer Tony and Leon Port please do come back to us.

Thank you, but the Demise of Legacy Media is a media show perennial and there are few publications that scream Legacy milady Britain's oldest women's magazine originally marketed when it launched in 1885 as a journal for Gentleman it published its last print edition this month joining our Rachel Johnson former editor of the lady and Helen Budworth the current editor and hell and I'll come to you in a moment, but I did want to ask Rachel just something up how bigger part of your career was added.

Was it important to you very important? I think it seems like it.

I had a disproportionate impact at the lady.

I was actually only honour to serve as the 9th two-and-a-half years or so, but of course every time of the lady is in the news often is because it's a much-loved part of the National fabric.

I must of course I have lied so I was the night that Helen is the current editor and I just have to say she has done an absolutely bang up job and I'm very glad to see the publication folding it's print for anyway, and I'm very interested to hear what Helens plans are to keep the title a flute as we go into another decade or so of the lady because it served its loyal readership and it's served its market and people who used the magazine not just for baguette.

Household staff or whatever but also for the features and its many glories since the start that's 1885 the magazines reported being recording under pressure for a while, but the announcement that this month's edition is to be the last it was still on expected.

Yes, you're absolutely right.

We have been under pressure for some time and we never say that is completely expected because it you know it looks falling ad revenues falling sales on the new stand folding number of subscribers is not only something that is unique to the lady.

It's across print Media really but the report this is because of unpaid tax and national insurance.

Is that accurate there is an element that that we had a weird did have an issue with HMRC and we had reached agreement with them.

We were making your payments and but it's just seeing you wasn't good enough were saying HMV take a supportive approach to dealing with customers who have Tax debts and only for a winding up petitions wants exhausted all other options and it's interesting because you were saying the magazine industry is under let me know that like you know many other parts of the media, but many are still holding their own.

I'm thinking about the Olde for example which seems to be doing well and has a you know had been rising and certainly had a steady subscription Macy is it just that you're subscription-based with two small.

I think it's 11000 that just wasn't enough to keep it going.

Yes, I mean the cost of producing the magazine.

Is last in a you have all the contributors printing paper it is it's not a cheap thing to do when you look at what the lady is actually renowned for it's actually be loud for being d place to recruit domestic staff is not renowned for its editorial.

Yes story was brilliant even though I say so myself and of course never better than under Rachel but we are actually been around for is being d place to recruit staff in if I would meet people and people the first thing people say to me was so you know we always used to get a housekeepers through the lady or I got my first job through the lady and

The lady has a a fond place in many people's hearts and back in on that because you know I guess the lady is best known for its advertisements for Butlers amazing the light but you said it's the only title read from the small ads at the back to the features upfront by upstairs downstairs and the staff and residents of royal palaces are like I'm going to believe you on that one, but I think that's true Because to me the the small ads as Helen has the same are the engine of the publication I mean the publication with good front and back but I read the back because each small add to me was Astoria short story in itself a window into another world and and just look at me know TV is making a fool part drama series about Jane Andrews is the Duchess of York's former dresser who was convicted of murder and of the Duchess of York Foundation answers to guess where the back end of the lady magazine.

Paul Potts series that come along the ladies appeared in Upstairs Downstairs it's appeared in Downton Abbey it is it is the quintessential Upstairs Downstairs patient and I mean I'm still waiting to hear what do with with the title to retain the small ads and the title and maybe some online form.

I think it is and I don't think the bed where family Helen and Ben is a Valiant job in keeping her the lady ship Afloat during their tenure.

I do you think there's something in it.

I would sad to see it go under the waste completely but Helens right in saying that it is primarily reading book for its small ads and those are the Crown Jewels and so they need to be kept safe and polished and we will ask Helen in a minute to give us a bit more insights and how it might keep going but just read your first under your Tanya did got a bit of a reputation.

This is how the Daily Mail put it anywhere that kind of tinder for toffs after you brought in the personal classified ads that Ben and Helen who was the business brain cause before she became did introduced personals and I think they're roaring success.

I mean it's no longer does personal so I advise everybody anyone who is a lonely hearts and I just go straight to the lady.

You know Cambridge professor 6-well upholstered at home counties blonde all of life is so everybody should should Rush out and buy the April Edition and then subscribe online and saving keep it going and just in terms of your time there.

I like you're always good with the turn of phrase and you said you wanted to make it more hip than hip replacement.

Is a very good line that does sound like Emma Stone so they go but do you think do you think you did? Did you manage to modernise? Did you manage to bring any younger audience? I think we did I think the average age when I took over 2009 let that sink in average age 78 and I think in 2012.

It has gone to Helen probably no more late 50/50.

I mean obviously when you know about the subscriber than off the shelf and a survey of the subscribers indicated that their average age was 51 gone down since the beginning of Rachel's time in that sense.

It's a success if you want people who are younger in my last longer reading it but in terms of Rachel's question and I'll question what what is the plan so the printer?

Is definitely gone but what is the plan is there a plan to keep the lady going? I'd like to hope so my plan is to have a bit of a rest.

I mean 37 years in media and I think I've earned a bit of a rest so does that mean no more you I'm saying it classifies will continue all night.

Is that not right? I don't know I think the plan is to keep it going Ben's keeping it going at the minute.

What about the subscribers you subscribe for a year or never heard.

Will they get their money back now? You're not printing it that is down to our subscription house.

I believe they will have to go through to the subscription house because true gdpr and the Wonders of all that we haven't got the details of our subscribers right and Rachel Johnson to bring you back in towards the end, UK

Relations with Helen having a difficult relation to the sum of the old god I think Julian's Julia bad word mum with the current owner she told him that you were being shallow overpaid publicity mad penises if I can say that on the explain this many times and too many articles.

She heard me talk about trident and I said it was a really well, and I think that's somehow stuck in her mind.

I've written and I'll say it again.

I think that's probably what went wrong with my tenure at the lady was that Junior Bedworth should have been added some reason the family didn't consider her eligible to take on the family title and I think it's it must have been asked her to me and come in and dancing and create a bit of a buzz around the magazine that she felt she was hers by right and birthright.

Because I hate to bring it with them but we are at the end of the show Rachel Johnson thank you so much Alan Budworth we will watch this space when it comes to the lady.

Thank you to all my guests today next week talking to Katie balls is leaving our Shores and The Spectator magazine and heading to America for the times and the Sunday Times that's it for me goodbye and from The History podcast and BBC Radio 4.

This is invisible hands the story of the free market Revolution the free market isn't solving the problem of homelessness Free Enterprise markets hidden Force the change Britain forever listen to invisible hands on BBC sounds now.