Read this: Read All About It... in America?

BBC sounds music Radio podcasts from BBC Radio 4 hello a transit program today.

We've got the US company that's big in Britain the boss of Google this side of the pond is with us and we've also got the British newspapers.

You were trying to make it big in the US will be finding out why the pub of the mirror and the Express think the Americans are ready for some British style tabloid journalism in a bit, but let's start with Matt Britton he's a president of Google for Europe the Middle East and Africa which made a pretty important guy Matt welcome to the media show BBC so Congratulations

40% of young people when they're looking for a place for lunch.

They don't go to Google Maps all the search engine.

They go to tiktok or Instagram or worry.

Are you worried? I think we've always been Focus give users really useful information.

I started at Google 16 years ago that was the days where we access the internet through a computer only dial-up and you Google really wasn't of gay but if you look at how we searched you going on holiday airbnb or booking.com gift to Amazon or whatever so we got hugely different ways of accessing information including through publishers as well.

So what we tried to do is innovation and trust in search make it as relevant and helpful as possible and some of the ways we do that for example 8 billion times a month now people use their camera to search with Google lens, you pointed at something tell you what it is and you can then do multi search which is a new feature where you can say let's take a photograph is green plant pot and save get this but in pink.

Royston ever before still using Google but they're also using many other services and I think that's one of the things.

That's good.

It's competition and Innovation often using AI and gives us more choices than ever before I think we need to be kind of constantly worrying about making a product something that's useful for everyone and trusted and as a key part of what I do every day and when it comes to your own job, is it a big part of it to lobby governments in Europe to make sure Google gets what it wants when it comes to regulation or how much tax you have to pay for example of what we've seen in the last 3-years rightly is governments around the world wanting to put in place rules of the road for technology and it becomes so important you seen it through the pandemic.

You know the taxi federation and is part of everyday life for everyone and of course what they want to do is understand.

What the technology you can do.

How do we make sure the technology is highest for good and we fight the bad and part of my job is to explain those things to policymakers as they work on those new builds and what?

Position where they want to hear from us.

Because we got expertise but we don't expect the rules of the will be written in the way that we would we would like we've got some big new bills at the moment in Europe the digital services is all about the responsibilities of platforms and in the UK the online safety bill which is even broader than the European Bill and covers a lot of areas of responsibility and we really welcome that you know the objectives of that bill are about keeping you say for helping to ensure that you have privacy and freedom of expression and we will come onto that I just wondered because I was he mentioned tax.

I know you probably have a very well with her tonsils how much tax Google does pay in the UK could you afford to pay more especially the cost of living crisis? I think it's important.

You know in the world today.

Everybody needs to be funding the in a huge cost of covid in the crisis in energy and so I think company be doing more and that's something which governments have to decide but I think the political Choice take it sometimes in the headline around taxis for not how much we pay but where it's paid in the debates always been in a is enough paid in the car.

The UK when we make the money vs.

The home Market the US and there's been International Records of shift out in the UK's also put more taxes on tech companies we pay hundreds of billions in the UK but I think we're going to have to pay more giving what's classed as possible so generate profits and jobs and growth in exports.

That's what I focus on and you talked about the online safety bill something that is your mom's bill as well.

It's been going through well quite a few changes and been a very lengthy bill going through or not going to Parliament the fact that a bill to regulate the internet is even necessary is evidence that you're not able to keep your own house in order.

Isn't it? So I told you that I mean what we've got his technology.

What's the rules of the road written before smartphones.

So got a new technology that can do new things.

Horsey there for me to put in place a set of regulations that sets standards the protect us as I say, this is important about keeping you safe online protecting privacy and also protecting freedom of expression and there are some important trade-offs in the government should rightly be making that doesn't mean to say that we haven't wait.

It's oh Google we don't wait for regulation won't be trying to build products that are trustworthy with clear products clear policies.

They transfer the report on how we do on those things and then I can explain a bit more about how we do that is useful in light of this regulation.

Is it makes it? They haven't we haven't waited we already have in place really thorough content moderation over 20000 people globally look at content moderation on YouTube and Google properties and I was person in a number of years ago now.

We saw that find experience with using video to try to radicalise people on YouTube and other platforms and we decided we needed to have a party that wasn't illegal.

Decide what is an isn't allowed it's a free speech well, but it's not harmful so we worked with 150 expert agencies Europe of the home office Institute for Strategic dialogue and someone to come up with some policies to define that we then trained people to classify videos and then when I can do accurately we train machines and now we report on how effective that policy as I can tell you that 90% of videos that I like that policy never seen by single human, so we can do that in the context of a legal framework, but then codes of practise and transparency with regulators.

I think that's the way forward with online safety bill sets of responsibilities, but then you need to develop policies, which will change over time so would you say the system is working at the moment in terms of protecting people because I think that's done that ourselves, but that's not consistently outstanding cross the different tech platforms and we see you know Twitter in the news and others so I think there's an importance of having a set of standards for everyone is also important.

I think that there's a larger players the more popular platforms like YouTube

Taiyabah because you no more people are using them everyday.

I think that's appropriate him and then we say we were talking to regulators or you're not explaining the kind of thing I just talked to you through and what we've learnt about how you can help setting a combination of governments civil Society and tech companies working together to address these challenges as they arise.

If you don't have money Russell for example.

Yeah the coroner ruled that the site some of the site.

She was looking at were not safe as the coroner put it goes out to her family in anybody affected by those kinds of issues.

I think he did Russell her father's been really effective campaigner for stronger safety standards online and I think that's part of what the online safety bill is seeking to do it as a parent and as a technology company.

We take our responsibility seriously we already do a huge amount and also involved in that particular case but I mean let's talk about how you can be a force for good.

So if you search and you're in that moment of crisis turns around suicide we work with the Samaritans and others to make sure the first thing you see is a link to to talk to somebody at the cimarron and content that can be helpful in those moments so technologies neutral and it can be helpful in those moments of crisis and need and that's what we need to make sure I can do is talk about what sanctions tell me what punishment do you think Google should face if you break the new rules that the government to introduce obviously find the whole range of functions are already in current rules, but I think is important with platforms to get the balance right and this is something for government, but let's just talk about this as a child safety which I think we discover that a regulator decides that you should have removed some content in you haven't and you get an enormous fine for it for a small platform that say that means you're 10 towards removing content which is marginal.

Freedom of speech have been there's a real concern around having very big consequences on things which I'm very clear.

There's no legal kind of definition of some of the content that you you have the alternative witches access and a non democratic country might use their don't worry about Twitter because he's being very clear.

He wants the vastly Amazon free speech on the platform Twitter have to push the boundaries for example and hate speech for you to pull it from Google's app store well.

You have very clear policies on App Store it's like a retailer as to what we require different apps to do in order to qualify to be there and that includes content moderation policy, so we're ready.

What is the lowest to do that.

I don't have a party in my head but

Sleep so parlour in a couple of other apps initially didn't comply with our policies.

I believe I believe they are now there because they have now got some content moderation policy.

We will keep those things under people and how they comply with the policies and not something on directly responsible for the offer this two different things.

I think there's what policies should Twitter have and that's for them on YouTube we can define what are policies are anybody can look them up and secondly shoe stores carry out like Twitter and is up for up for the app stores and there are many you know this is the Apple version of that put on Android which is the operating system that we make them in the phones around the world are so different competition and different policies in different stores will pass under review obviously want to keep you safe online but we also.

Choice of platforms with different colours individual companies put in place and I want to talk about Google relationship with news publishers and OK Google is the single biggest source of traffic for every major news website in this country the research for intelligence estimate to make more than 8 billion pounds and revenue here last year you dominate online search advertising as I said it means newspapers from traditional and it's hard to make a local newspaper example profitable.

I don't agree with all of the things you said there but I mean let me say I was a publisher I work for what is now reach before I join Google 16 years ago and we are actually probably the world's biggest set off journalism and let me just explain a little bit about what we do first when you come to Google Search and ask Chris about news then that happens 80 billion times a month and we send you to news publishers.

And when somebody comes from newspapers estimated be worth 3 to 5 pence per click the first thing so huge amount of traffic that qualified we really work hard to make sure quality contents of the top but that's not enough we also help with the advertising and you'll see ads from Google on apps and on-site from publishers the majority is the revenue goes to the publisher I can't give you a full UK numbers but the top five publishers over the last 3 years nearly 250 million from Google ads and that's complementary to their own advertising Revenue and then we train 4000 journalists and we've given grants and funding to 240 smaller publisher so we do a huge amount to try to support publishing.

I mean I just don't accept that what people have is more choice than ever of new sources and we all have to you you have to have the BBC and all the pubs have to compete for that audience what we've tried to do is ensured that will be good looking for them.

I can find find the sources that they trust and help them to monetize and actually the editor of The Times of said recently in journalism striving.

I just saw the Guardian had its highest profit for 20 years economic policies are doing well, but we should be concerned that quality content continues to thrive and we fight misinformation.

I'm at the other part of what we do is trying to ensure that this information is reduced and removed.

We do believe there's a relationship between tech companies in news publisher for local journalism.

Yeah, I mean the fact is that that Google matter and Amazon 50% of all of the digital and dollars that's a huge problem for you know even the biggest players and polishers in in in in the business.

I mean if you're getting that if you.

USA today you are looking at a very slim margins.

They laid off 400 people they asked 400 further positions in the last few weeks.

I think if you are a journalist sitting behind a desk.

You are looking at how Google go algorithm.

Essentially controls.

What people say the search engine optimization which is basically when you go to the Google Search box and you take what's the best pizza in in London Google will bring up content It's News publishers rely on Google to send traffic and so you know this is a very big debate right now News Corporation which owns the times and newspapers in Australia have been fighting a battle to get big tech to pay for contour to make sure that if the likes of Google and Facebook are monetizing content that solve it comes to them.

I guess they would argue that not enough is coming to them and so.

We'll see what happens if it's interesting that Amazon has caravan new entrant hear something so I was too old you actually happened.

This has been an explosion of new companies advertising most of my customers are small businesses advertising for the first time is not a zero-sum game because I've tried to explain earlier.

I think we do a huge amount try to help publishers make money is not for us to fix the business model of publishing but many are being successful in there are some properties owned by private equity intern where there's a lot of cost management going on as well, but I think if Citizens Advice more choice of journalism than ever before so come from really high quality outlets if you had of the Times company is saying you know journalism is thriving I think that's encouraging but I think I responsibilities and then we always need to be doing more and be more transparent about wire story ranks higher when people search for it and so on.

Is tableau is really bad to grab a crack America this is the news this month for the newspaper group reach is launching American versions of some of its titles like the mirror AliExpress the Irish star some joined by Liz hazelton director the express.co.uk Christina Garibaldi correspondent for us weekly which is a celebrity news and entertainment magazine in America and David yelland former editor of The Sun from 1990 to 2003 who runs kitchen table Partners and communications company we start with you.

What is the untapped opportunity as you see it here so I think for us.

We just see it as a brilliant first move into new Markets and it's interesting that we started talking about local journalism.

We probably spent the last five years trying to work out what that model looks like now, so geographically we're pretty well place in The Emperor's it just seems to be time to look at the US what can we bring to the table there were obviously not the first to do it Daily Mail 2010.

I think so about 3 years ago.

So we're coming into marketing trying to find WhatsApp position is ready to start off with and I think it's interesting in the Irish star is a particularly interesting for us just print but actually we think they market their next community.

There's a lot of people interested in the States and we think that work for them and then I was just going to ask a bit more details of how about dedicated reporters chasing American stories or will you be repackaging British content for a US audience and the rest of the family for example? It is very much about being in the US and writing for us audience so I think we're looking at quite considerable scale here, so I don't see any point in launching at any level without having people on the ground looking for life stories connecting with an audience and building loyalty around that and I think for each of those brands.

We think we got away into the market that will give us something different.

It's also interesting I would.

We've seen audience from the US grow for each other titles ever closer time which is really why we made the decision to jump now and Christina travion correspondent for us weekly which is a celebrity news and entertainment magazine and what's your take on this welcome? You know a lot of competition and you know it's interesting because American Gothic American tabloid magazines are sometimes beautiful little bit differently than UK tabloid magazines UK tabloids 100 Taurus little bit more aggressive some times which American tabloids do as well, but you know where we're going for the latest headlines as grab were the headlines and that's what we really want to do but you know having a lot of competition.

You know we're going to be fighting for those headlines and those clicks and those views and things like that.

So it could be interesting to see where everybody kind of room for it.

Do you think I mean?

Publications like your own cover this content pretty well on their own.

No that is true, but I do feel like sometimes the British tabloids do take it a little bit further you know the Daily Mail we see you know where constantly looking at stories us because they have boots on the ground and you know getting those photos that maybe we wouldn't necessarily get because they're a little bit more intrusive from Harry and Meghan and then but you know obsessed with the royal family so anything royal family we kind of you know celebrate over because you know it will be interesting.

I think there's always room for everything but will be like I said interesting to see what kind of everybody finds himself in this new landscape in Sydenham is it a good by which do you think because obviously you know already mentioned that already and number British titles operating successfully in America not leave us under the MailOnline

I thought super fast journalism aggressive tabloid journalism, I read the MailOnline everyday it doesn't just you know photographs of celebrities that business stories in politics as a little bit of everything Sports it's a vibrant mix of the song is already over here the sun is the 8th fastest-growing publication in November than 36% in November they get a bit of a lift from the New York Post which is a sibling I see some stories in The New York Post about the things happening in Britain so I guess peopleclick those links at the end of the day.

This is about the business models of scale and advertisers and not going to be bothering with outlets that generate a couple of million visits a month.

They want big audiences to put their ass against in the more.

You know automated this becomes you know the more.

People have to get so BBC also is is growing in the US and also has a plan to get bigger, so it doesn't feel the moment and you know you've got a tabloid journalism on both sides of the Atlantic is your deputy editor of the news corp a New York Post 49090 7:55 before becoming editor of The Sun surely the idea of launching British terminals in America has been tried many times before what do you think about it well at the world changed because of the very low it doesn't make a lot of money.

Do you make more money at the top end that are growing.

Economist than half an hour that's $60 a month, so that is at least at least so people in London so the Brits the higher end of the UK at the US market and it's a lot of work, but it isn't the great BBC don't charge in London UK why would they turn to the US publication to find anything out when you think about the other way around? Why would they turn to mediums local?

So this is about to reach it makes common sense because they can extend their reach into the us know there's a the Irish star is a really interesting play because there's a massive community in in the US that thing to do but you know the talk tonight in the US are MSNBC BBC and CNN well lucky in this country because we have the BBC so we had a water cooler place that you got something terrible happened like the story the Channel today millions of people around the world will go to the BBC to find out what's happening with a trusted site in the US you don't have that there is not one single place that people go to the lots of places and that makes for a very actually you know it might be that that's cool.

Seen in US Democracy in the last few years, but I'm old enough to remember going to a news corp and play the sun Valley Idaho and came and elected to all the news editors going to change the world and we all sat there and continues to survive so you know that and it will be will just wondered whether you know it was talking about the reputation of the British tablets.

Do you think it's a problem venture the British travellers? Have a bit of a bad reputation in America getting worse if you watch Harry and Meghan

Doing good stories turning around quickly and doing a range of stories which is already been mentioned, so new shapes and school and offering that complete package really so I'm not I'm not too concerned.

I think we will place now to to capitalise on what is great Christina

No, I mean we've worked 2-hours transfer.

You know headlines in stories and we have to follow up considerably anything and I'm sure you guys.

I'll do as well.

So like I said you know it's just going to be more competition and more ways to get stories out there and then I won't have to wait and see what happens with me has something to say about this great.

We have you got to tell us the moment.

I think there's a moment in the UK at the moment is now which is like how we define ourselves in in the world of the future and what this conversation illustrated is that people want British quality contents and technology is enabling British businesses large and small whether it's journalism or video or gaming and also e-commerce we can be world leaders in all these things in the world by 60% the light and the rest are coming and I think the challenge the publishing industry is David Wright the Illustrated is here at the beginning or kind of thinking.

It's a joke, but actually the way Papas has been brace technology.

That's why the future of journalism.

I think I'm up to.

What would you say to that? Yeah? I mean I had a look at the song today to see what they were publishing for the American audience and it is the u-mix of the Kardashians in their underwear and a bunch of Murder stories, so I would hope that British coming to the US to my home country will come up with a broader range of topics that will expire audiences in the states that Debbie does a brief password, do you think British tabloid journalism translates for an American audience?

I'm not sure it does if I'm honest I mean it's a very did the u.s.

And UK Churchill's famous words are there two separate countries separated by a common language Culture in the US join and join us about what they do but why are there so many Brits editing us pacification journalist am I jealous but we do produced in 20 seconds.

Tell me what would success look like for you.

What will it look like a great story you great stuff on the ground over there.

Obviously a good audience and some good good revenue from you.

I guess we'll have to say and what counts as a good audience.

Can you phone number on it this point probably not because I think there's obviously 320 million people there are plenty of options best of luck with it say thank you to all of you.

I'm afraid.

What time for Matt Britton president of emea business and operations at Google is hazleton, editorial director express.co.uk Media Insider David yelland from editor of The Sun and Christina Garibaldi correspondent for us weekly.

That's it for now.