Read this: The End of Political TV? What Andrew Neil's departure means for BBC News

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Hello and welcome to the media podcast.

I'm on today's show are the BBC's political programme still cutting the mustard can Snapchat be Netflix game the government backs plan to save local newspapers and the secret group of stoking online harassment in Suzie Marsh welcome back to the show a very promising debut you disappear tomorrow is for awhile.

What you up to? These days my history is television but I'm making adverts now.

Stepped slightly sideways into a whole different area of program making but live ads which is another whole different world as well live adverts on a Saturday night always good fun.

Don't want so give us an example recently what we've been doing is adverts that are basically very short game show winning lots of money in the 52nd lads live from various places around the country with Stephen Mulhern you may would have seen it between X Factor but that's what we do get a location we broadcast live return it round and 1550 seconds clear quartz watch it give us a go ahead so it's very hard to the pressure of a live tv.

Show on primetime TV and advertising client as well, and I'm also doing it in front of you know whether it could be broadcast or not and they decide with a minute to her.

Emeritus of journalism at City University Liz hywel, hi Liz the university and that's carrying on and there's quite a lot of onions that I've got that deliver by September this year actually it is recon expert women which is where we started in 2011 campaign.

That's a good news story.

I mean it's down to only twice as many men as women now as it is to fix very thankful shouldn't absolutely fine but in other areas.

It's not so great those areas that your report cos if you look at the reporters on the big beast show say ITV news and BBC News you've got more than twice.

Men as women and there's no reason for that with experts.

There is a reason because the level of female expertise in society is probably less than the level of expertise in society for historical reasons, but there's no reason why television station should employee management reporter and not a woman podcast it has been revealed that the mother of late-night classical programming this week is coming to an end as longtime host Andrew Neil this using earlier bedtime director of BBC News and Andrew Neil one of your big stars basically comes to you and says he was quick that show would you then acts the show as well ratings are actually likes of this week and I don't suspect there particularly fabulous within that genre.

He's a big star but actually there may be secretly rather glad to see it.

Go that's that's my reading the

Fran Unsworth has said we'll explore the possibilities with Andrew Neil and he is still going to be presenting other and it goes but maybe it's time for this one to go I recommend if you looked at the appreciation index, which I haven't bothered to do if you did it would be pretty high for this week because for the people who like that's ok.

Love.

That's not the point is to people love it to Pieces what what good is that? I agree? I think it's so difficult thing to be niche for certain area of it is lovely and to be very well appreciated and have a cult Following as it were it with a small amount of people but is it kind of places there are lots of opportunities.

It's it's AP lists of quirky and actually is that what we want now anyway.

Do we want him dancing? I mean to me watching a new thing.

I find it very disquieting to watch that and and also what what the tension is it getting is it getting the right attention from the things that it does do in actually is that the attention that is wanted at?

Something serious is happening in politics.

Isn't it? And maybe this sort of show is not that sort of stuff that's fun long time ago the thing is I think it's probably had its day and everybody at the moment who works in politics is thinking how we going to reflect this new thing that we don't even know what it is.

It's evolving as we sit here.

I don't know how many more MP resigned since we watching them in the door.

You know it's a very difficult time and political shows are in that melting pot.

Are you did have the woman's it was them from Labour and the man from the door and it was a two party world and as you say it's a completely different will be having what's the closest thing to be on telly but can reflect that and you got this new format for politics live which is sort of like 8 people sitting.

There is a formula.

That is ready yet.

I really don't think it's going to be involved with the politics that when you're dealing with it all very new.

Everybody's having to change the way they consume at the way they think about it the way they believe it or don't believe it because there are so many different opinions now and everybody shouting as loud as somebody else and we will have to listen to all of them.

Be there as well, so I'm constantly confused and and so many people are bothering to look at what the detail and the fact is and that's the other thing.

I think people want really clear re concise information.

I think you are a group of men and they are predominantly men who are in with the In Crowd in politics and tell you how it is and that's really changing it is democratizing different way.

There's still a gap for that and it's you know whatever it is still him with his opinions be his own or others but they still feel like it's coming from the same place and we're in such a different place now.

Sent me to represent all of us feels that is not something that can be done within that one so very much these big beasts to opine my name's you know that does Nick Robinson and Adam Boulton and there's and Anil but they're all of a time and the time is not now other presenters, then you could imagine a Julia hartley-brewer Laura James O'Brien hosting matshow.

Why get rid of it because it's Phil are going to do it.

They want to do it differently and the activation Susie is that the BBC is running away from its commitment to political news? They're losing 10-minutes of the News at Ten to Showcase BBC3 programmes Monday to Wednesday Sunday Politics has been axed replaced and even politics live that talk about it's shorter than it's predecessor, which was Daily Politics that's not a good look at the moment.

Anyway, isn't it? Because there is very little appointment of you be in it across Generations as well.

Will I can watch Sky News constantly their beat their batting against total 24-hour news running we can drop in and out.

I'm not going to sit down at 10 anyway.

Generally know but it did you know there's a smaller audience for that and to be honest to dying audience.

Isn't it? So the people who are coming out to capture the people who are going to be interested in short shop Snapchat bursts of information and use give them in a way that they went to digest.

I think it is about reapproach the result of the Sloane which is also mitigating on the detecting against these shows in the perhaps.

We don't want the cleverest presenter.

Tell us what think about politics.

We need something.

That's more that.

I don't know what the answer is but I'm not surprised that changes afoot NewsNow it could disappear unless the government provides Direct financial support.

Independent report on the future of the British media about the press about the printed Media in terms of broadcasting local news cannot disappear under the current broadcasting for 6:30 local news programme on ITV and BBC is probably here to stay for the foreseeable future the local presence different matter.

That's not something that I'm an expert that is certainly something.

I'm quite interestingly.

I've just been as we speak come away from a panel discussion at the RSA about the tipper supposed to negative news and the balance of news one of the interesting point is that since there's been less local news in the papers.

There has been less positive news in the Easter because I'm fly workboard Italian for many years lots of people sneer at the idea of order television.

It's a very small ITV company but actually getting stories on to that program requires more skill and more consideration.

Much easier to follow national music genders, but there was quite a lot of positive news because it wasn't the audience with prettify you you know like you're my brown-eyed troops really just wondered why isn't it on your knee and there's nothing it's happy stuff, but this and positive not just happy but actually constructed and that is diminished with the Demise of local newspapers.

So it's not Democracy in the centre of covering local councils and son it's furnace in the reflection of stories in the community and the pressure is on local programs now that BBC and ITV was the national news what everything is drama and alarm so in this review Susie Dame Frances cairncross wanted Direct funding for public interest news outlets from a new Facebook and Google is dominant in the ad market a new code of conduct between publishers and large tech companies to make sure the publishers are treated fairly.

What was your reaction to that stuff?

It makes absolute sense to have more funding is to these things to help people and people to become involved in to protect the resources that we haven't to encourage.

Is it how it is administered and how is it decided upon that is the issue because if it's another group of people who aren't part of the everyday want on the grassroots level deciding and I think he just becomes you know another layer in the whole thing but I I I feel that that's where everybody starts grassroots and everything put because it's everyday life.

That's reflected everybody that they can see part of their lives part of their world's and such that bit of news.

Where is obviously national news agenda.

Feels very big and scary to those people just sitting home and I started out doing local cable news back when it was a requirement by the cable providers to provide x hours a week of local television news and that was kind of because

We were just the same as a local local Guardian local rag, you know we just did exactly the same things as they did so we were looking for the positive stories.

We were meeting on the local people to be on that level and to see those to learn and for people to find their places in anishas in their interest that level is really important.

I think it's difficult if it's someone from High deciding how it works is that something the government should be doing play started out with the old IVA which was very involved in what you did and when you are.

I be a representative very well and they were really quite prescriptive and then it went to the ITC which was much more National

You very much very focused and quite difficult to deal with but still quite prescriptive then it became off which is the light touch and now they're talking about this new is talking about this new regulator I can't quite see how it's going to work.

You can't make people do things especially commercial that make any money if people don't want to see the court reports and they don't want to see the local the local council.

I'm afraid is not going to cut it in this very attractive visual world really nobody is going to watch local council is a move in this auntie commercial space to show entrance back in isn't man you see this with the audio content fund if you looked a bit.

Yeah, that's come from from the government with former director of Radio 4 BBC at the helm and requires to make a radio show that would not normally be broadcast on Commercial Community Radio cos it's not commercial so you know it'll be an art show or you know.

Dramas broadcast it's going to be something that's commercial absolutely very confusing me.

Why are you going to watch it obviously in the past of the very serious problems of being broadcast quite rightly I'm under regulation that wouldn't have had a muscle but they would have had an audience and the difficulty with this is if you're making something of people going to watch because the government funding you to make it.

It's a waste of everybody's time and money.

I mean I'm a great sense.

I do believe there's no point in doing something in case people actually demonstrate.

They wanted only be a few people or it may be people for example.

It would attract a certain type of advertising or sponsorship.

Also just to do it because some arcane government organisation thinks it's good for you.

I don't think that will wash in the modern world.

Sky Arts when it first started it felt for most people would be watching Sky quite separate to what that kind of you would want and get the content on it is extreme I do watch it.

I love your smile with Jane Fonda so I can see that there will always be a little group of people who will be pleased because if the majority of the only ones are always puppies, then, what about the minorities and a little bit of what they want as well as not a bad thing because we can't please all the people all the time.

Just giving more money.

Just giving more money back to the BBC they're already trusted.

They already provably independent from government and they already used to have generous all over the country doing this kind of thing because they're quite big and it's not a good to inflate the mini further.

Should they be the only one isn't actually different perspective is what we need and what we all want when we all watch other channels and all do different things so I just think more than one person deciding sure he is a butt handed to the BBC they have funded local area.

Is there isn't it does seem to have worked in that the numbers of local generously funded have gone up from tiny to not so tiny whether or not that's very me another issue.

I think it's very mean over the years.

I've seen people try to force the hand of organisations trying to make them do things and in the end.

It doesn't work unless it's enormous will behind it Sky Arts I really wanted to do it.

It was perhaps of Vanity projects.

They have the money to do it at work.

They have been prepared to do that on series.

I did last year was done in Dolby stereo in your

And some ways because nobody can watch that however it was a slight banter, but it is it's showing off what they have and using all of those skills and all of the new technology to demonstrate.

Where are not market after I remove Sky News is the ultimate vanity project and he wanted to do that cos I was the managing editor at Sky News when it started and it was done because that's what he wanted to do and he wants said something with entertainment you make money but with you down at the White House in that was his reason for doing it in the seats of power as well, which is talk radio as in the station Rugby Sevens in his virgin Breakfast Show you might have a bit about that.

He's he's on Virgin apparently broke some hardcore me.

Birds news this week when Chris Evans appeared to announce that talk radio is going to be changing its name to talk news now that may not actually be true.

I've been doing some digging around and news.co.uk has been registered yet sounds to me like a slip of the tongue or something he said off the cuff and then he's actually said in these quoted the singer which of the boss which I presume is Rebekah Brooks and said oh, she said you said this thing and he said oh yeah and she said because it's you Chris that's what we call it.

I don't know but because another of their properties talk radio does mostly talk about the news.

Maybe it would help if it helps some Focus it's just a very strange way to announce it, but you know it's good, isn't it?

Again been clear to the audience what you're trying to tell them about what you are.

I think that can only help but yes, it is very hard, but then that's what happens to I just said it wouldn't necessarily attractive news on such will it very clearly positions you know what I mean? I wish I knew what was going on his lunch time drinks radio if you really wanted to make it's just that what you do this really weird idea have a woman woman eating breakfast on talk radio.

The people that he would be discussing about coming in are people that he probably knows it's so if you had to radio, what would you do to try and raise the profile? Would you say focus on news like lpcb arrival to LBC or would you say part of the reason that we're Grande culty audiences.

We got Iain Lee and Howard Hughes and Bob Mills we do stuff that isn't you do with it? I think it's very difficult because I don't really understand that their target audience.

That's why I think it's in my view gone a bit hey why I don't know who it is that they want to listen to it.

I wouldn't listen to it and I know people work with it.

So I've got to be very careful, but I don't know many people actually listened to it.

So it seems to me that they got to go rather talk about what presenters they have they all look about what we talked about the TV production has kudos their chief executive is leaving the indeed after 9 years and several high-profile conditions under his belt.

This is Beatrix Santa who is responsible.

Tin star Grantchester humans is ago in Grenada when we were all very young ameriki and that's about the nearest ever got to pick fabulous stuff and it's great it would seem to be reading this story that this is one very talented does it was the producer whose had a good raft of hits and that's great, but is he absolute is he the the Lagerfeld of TV production? I think so maybe I don't know enough obviously he's made his name to the to the masses with EastEnders and was hugely popular a timer 20 stenders had it's alright real peak.

Yeah, and that's certainly made inroads in that area of James Harding you know I want to try something new but I'm not quite sure what it is, but I'm leaving where I am and it's actually this is the drama see makes, what is the drama?

Things we don't know about time in the job as well, isn't it really and I think you nowadays people on expected to stay anywhere as a distinguished off the media podcast Fake Britain and car boot yvt.

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Magic Thomson media news in brief play some CCR still with me and the social platform Snapchat is on the prowl for original content with a budget of almost £500,000 for returnable documentary and drama series on sounds like coming out of my mouth and the podcast on making big primetime stuff at the moment.

You know you're talking quite a lot more.

Could you make a Snapchat for half a million quite a lot Foreman who's watching in having spoken to young people before I came about this.

It's interesting to see how people will digest it's because quite often when I'm doing reviews.

Production is that it is instant and instantly gone so if they want to show a video it's done instantly don't have to save the video send it on so it's it's user abilities.

What's good to know so you can delete it which is again.

Why young people and other various ne'er-do-wells use it as well, so they will use it in terms of something that might be of interest then they might click on it actually when you're looking at social viewing habits.

You know to get 3 s diesel 10 second views is what people are pleased with to get someone to take with you for 45 minutes seems like a lot, but then obviously they've accessible series dramas, which you know you can imagine actually you know 4 minutes were the drama that feels quite doable and achievable in terms of allocation of time but they are so immediately bored.

Play seen it for a few seconds.

There's just so many places to make content now.

It's not like one of these things where you make something even for the BBC iPlayer but you can't guarantee that iPlayer is going to tell everyone about it might just disappear because you leave Snapchat one thing that actively promote you don't need to spend any money on marketing and they will actively promote and that's quite often.

What's happened in programs that I've done is that you've made of this program and giving you all this money.

You've spent hours and studio in the edit and then anything.

Where is the logic in a massive End show with getting One promo in one hashtag in a where they know how to promote things they know how to do it and how to cut into small short form to get people involved with like your ideas people turned up with all the crap that no one else wanted and say.

TV that was absolutely original promo which is just I just Googled it and it all looks like the sort of stuff.

We used to buy for trouble you know the team way back when it's so gypsy on there are so gorgeous and perfect it didn't attract disappointing poor Snapchat work.

We make gorgeous and people all the technical aspects that come with Snapchat so it's about you know there's a lot more graphics in hearts when they say things you can do to all of the pictures.

It's thinking of ways in which they can do that to best effect you get me interactive.

It is Peanuts really isn't that the money that they are offering and when I looked at the production values on the thing.

Really hard to replicate that your bedroom isn't it? Because they audiences and when it comes to the talent that you use for a production you're making for a platform right now.

Are you thinking? Do you know what I need to make sure that they're fully accessible all the time as part of the deal like if you're going home.

I show you have to accept the audience going to be contacting you.

What does that not come into it for a certain amount of acceptance of social involvement, but I think it is so ingrained in part of their lives people who be using it people use it but it's just it's not even a thing to discuss it.

They would automatically want to be involved, but unfortunately they feel his desperate need to be constantly appreciate that if you're trying to attract as many people to it possible because you've got someone there was established in that world.

All the time you would allocate a certain amount of posts to certain amount of xyz, and they would have to adhere to that cos that's the nature of the beast is it that's the way it's going around local news shows you just do it.

You've privacy of your own.

Ok.

Let's talk about something totally different and the Secret Facebook group of French journalists calling themselves the lol that's if you kind of transliterated coordinated the harassment of feminists people of colour and LGBT campaigns on social media according to reports from BuzzFeed please, can you summarise this of man who years ago? I think it started in 2009 as a Facebook group and it was basically a group of mates.

That's the way I see it who got to put a post Schneider unpleasant things about anybody wasn't like them and then it took off on Twitter and they would set off as a Twitter Storm by posting something on Twitter that was also offensive or attacking.

Turn the rest of that people would would pilot in having been alerted to this and then it would go viral and everybody would attack these people and it's really quite nasty unpleasant underhand the magazine a paper that out of this liberarsi one of their journalists there.

This is actually behind it and so he's not suspended and another guy has been suspended from another magazine because he actually set up a phone interview with a woman interviewed for a fake job and recorded it and then put it online and it's just nasty.

I think and no one is quite we're going to end and who's involved and you can you watching people getting sucked into that sort of male.

Let's have a bit of banter type of environment and these people are quite a high level of being sucked into that and have now been outed walked into.

Public facing let's do this person publicly thing what's interesting about it is the men involved at the time very old at the time.

They were about 25 so alarm ei141 women against many it's just heard of men having a go as banter or not when escalator that you are still making that decision to take part in that consistent and repetitive form of abuse to somebody and I mean little bit different different and it's multi-layered in France and there's lots of complicated things going on with my limited experience of working with French meaning of French journalist.

It is a little bit more sexy than here, but you know that probably just my one-off experience and it may not to be true, but that's how I feel and so I wasn't entirely surprised to find that.

I wouldn't be entirely surprised to find that it was going on in Britain either.

I came in as a young woman and many people men older younger would just be would just put you down you have to stand up for yourself so strongly or you know the amount of the religious walk away because they give up groups of 25-year old man just because like the students.

I've seen over the postgrad.

What for the last 15 years and sometimes you will get a little not of men really want to keep anybody out that's going to be very competitive and it's anybody.

Take the job a takeaway the opportunities and they will burn together and they will keep out anyone who doesn't like them because they feel that they are at the end title people even if there isn't the sort of maturity realise that you know misogynism isn't cool.

Isn't there now at least technological literacy that you think men in the 20s working in production in a secret group.

Anywhere might one day.

I mean they keep it secret and this lasted secret for a long long time.

I remember I was going to say this earlier.

I don't want me to but working at Grenada in the 1970s and we were all like people of the 70s everybody was equal and it was all gonna be great and I went to the canteen and I'm quite small size behind the sort of barrier you know and I heard my fellow male producers or talking about the women in the news.

Horrible way, and I was so disillusioned great blokes that I work that they weren't so great actually from the ridiculous to the sublime and the nominees are in for the National press Awards the Guardian in the ft a short listed for scoop of the year for their coverage of the Windrush and the Presidents club scandal respectively, that is what you make another nation that it's not the coverage, which I found fascinating.

I was in the British journalism awards as a and they're looking at the material all of the things.

I find very confusing about all of this is how many awards are off.

This is the national press Awards that were talking does the British journalism awards does the Royal television Society Awards there's the broadcasting Awards that it's endless.

I mean the so many different awards and then not going to reply.

Each other I think I don't know I have a tendency always 212 nominate people have took so I think I was interesting is Daily Mirror scope in popular life at TV star Jamie in spitting storm that's great news story.

Obviously not a problem turn the sun on Sundays and newlove which is obviously very important use a water type of surroundings of the stories that is an amazing story that can come out can help people can make a real difference and actually have impact on on many people you know the rest is just chewing gum sometimes you want a bit of fun.

The role of Personality something you're saying in a way, it's strange that it's about a body of work rather than individuals Google story generally but I suppose if these news organisations are now really conglomerates of individual personality and social media following I mean you know the award for Marina Hyde or Matthew Parris getting political commentators is more important than what they were talking about that is a person who consistently brings you everything and I think that's the whole point of the column.

This is a whole new programme we could talk about that forever and I'm not sure that's totally wholesome.

I think that this cause of having celebrity Colin this right as I'm not terribly thrilled about in the newspaper on the other hand there is just time for a media quiz three stories remedial and that you might have missed you at the same time.

I will give you a headline from a recent Media story you just have to spot the missing word.

Housing with your name man united answer so Suzy you will say let's go number one what is named best radio show of all time shows Desert Island Discs above the Arches and round the horn for a radio x radio x no commercial radio programs.

Would you put on the list of the best radio shows of all time?

Maybe I'm capital thank you.

I'm very nosey, so I like the fact that it tells you in that tells you more about the person and you would naturally find out the background.

I was a little things.

I don't have to feel better on the Moon by the way, they obviously we're just letting somebody else around set skills do it instead so they will always be with change comes complaints to BBC launches.

Play what's the answer play the same but anyway if you remember the name of the BBC's new clothing line.

How sad is that fits all models walk the London Fashion Week runway wearing ethically made sweatshirts as part of the corporations new sustainable me campaign which all sounds like something straight out of w1a, the idea is to capitalise on the success of blue planet around the world at the most watched British TV programme of 2018 and their campaign for sustainability does that make sense you running a BBC brand to have a closed sorry.

I guess it depends on who they want to notice.

It doesn't that again because I suppose.

Sweatshirt for the program that's true, so is t-shirts on your own clothing line, but this is the extra step isn't there like everything else everybody's taking another step dangling the we have BBC takeaway meals because it makes total sense but surely.

They could have their own fast food chain that be great.

There is inherent contradiction as well.

Isn't there but if the message of the program is stop making so much crap that goes to landfill you think that when they trying to flog the Blu-ray discuss after each episode absolutely chance to go for a drawer here.

It's question number 3 radio directors launch new what?

The audience at the same time as doing the podcast podcast Riley and friend of the moment vegan who have launched the live events company to bring podcast is face-to-face with their audience and I think it's a good idea, but I want started and events company gone back in the day and that that was a similar idea that we run events and people came along and we filmed and recorded and so and it was really difficult to organise is the difference of audience of the wants to be there as wants to listen to it and it can be excluding if you're not there, you don't want to hear it.

If you are that you've had it already.

It's a complicated tremors you not prioritising the listener the vast majority of this is who downloaded it for free in or making you go back to Tony Hancock in a very famous comedian and then.

Play radio radio and TV it was very popular and then did a shower at the London Palladium you know and it was fantastic be popular with the audience, but it was recorded and transmitted and absolutely bombed because you're with the different catchment in of the listener is very different from the person who's actually there in the theatre that very different do not show on the BBC were you know the Radio Theatre and you just go and watch the recordings that you know that thing is you can talk about this but then you know for a long time and doesn't live events and the excitement in the audience absurd as it sounds to meet their favourite podcast is so that's the difference that are being broadcast that is very different from having a very successful podcast or yeah, they meet the audience event.

Do come back again and competes for another chance of the title and if you want to pay £200 4 m in person? I've been looking to talk to me about organising know if you like what we are up to here at the media podcast you might come and see a live show that and you won't help us.

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