Read this: The Media Podcast #3 - John Oliver and World Cup take over the US

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Do it now the media podcast is a PPM production and not affiliated with the Guardian in anyway, and now the show hello and welcome to the media podcast I'm only man on today's show record-breaking global ratings for World Cup coverage.

Telegraph loses more big names in Jason seekins move to digital Jeremy Paxman leaves Newsnight with big shoes to fill and PR firm promise to put down their sock puppets and stop abusing Wikipedia that's all to come on today's Media podcast from the media podcast not come with me in the Soho are Faraz Osman creative director at television in the lemonade money and on the line from San Francisco yes, it's the director of the town centre for digital journalism, the one and only Emily Bell hello to you both up for us.

Let's start with you at what are you working on at the moment using to be tweeting about Nando's a last year? It's a bit of a crazy few weeks at the moment.

I'm not we are doing lots of work with Nando's at the moment lots of YouTube content for them.

You can check that out youtube.com forward slash Nando's UK do you get one of a special cards need to get the check-in can't talk about that have an organic.

Yes, no, can I say we might be the only production company.

Can't talk about that.

I think it might be a yam.

We doing for lunch later.

Oh my god best day of my life ever Emily let's start by talking about a bit of telly from your point of view because there's a British comedian some may have heard of John Oliver who is now left the Daily Show when he's got his own HBO share out there has any has that been going barely ever been hurt in the UK but who is gradually becoming you know quite a big star out there instead.

He's got a shower now which is straight after Game of Thrones it really does look at extremely come serious and difficult issues like the crisis in northern Iraq and yes, they're satire and humour and he's been at he's been doing that now for a few weeks since 9th generation.

Got an extremely favorable reaction time website when I say extreme reactions.

I mean formula delivers in New York I have no idea what text this makes a bit.

Shiraz why do you think it? Is that a show like that can work in the US and yet when we try and do something here like that.

Yeah, even just a weekly satirical comedy show it never really has the traction of people talking about it in positive ways like that.

Is it the size of the writers room? Is it you know? What is it? It? Is it is I think it's a simple as I think that the way that American TV does comedy with Hughes writer drums are so many writers.

It's it just means that the Investment they have behind the scenes in into the heart that means that they can't get away with what they can do that.

Don't that level of gags and do Saturday Night Live and and you know I'm a huge fan of The Daily Show I think that I think also what's Woody interesting about what HP have done with John Oliver is is that it feels like that show is getting known for these big viral rants that he's doing and it feels like there's a strategy there to build on the fact that Game of Thrones doing so well online and via Twitter what can we do to come and be embraced even further with with their schedules and I think that John Oliver has got a very good smart look.

The news when he's been entered with that is bringing somebody clever formats where he's using interactivity and using Twitter and using hashtags and and kind of getting people to Almost campaign around ideas that he has and that's really smart logic from HBO in capitalising on their online presence and in a way that's not just hate Wheatus now and follow us on scram.

It's is actually using that to build content is to the show now Emily you are joining us via Skype at sadly.

It's audio only Skype so we can't see the video but I imagine that you are wearing one of those hoodies that as there are selling covered.

It wasn't George's flag because of course it's World Cup season in America it's bigger than ever before I'm saying is coming up so I was out at work business dinner the other day and for the first time ever in America they were people Round Table who were Americans who were very answer about the fact that they couldn't.

the score the football scores on their mobile service no signal where I say football I make it come with brown because my hands are saying there's always a rat Russian interest in football in America soccer whenever the national team plays in in in the World Cup and there was four years ago, but it's kind of great now and and one of that one of the reasons to that is because you've had in the in the intervening period really comprehensive coverage from Fox and now from NBC things like the English Premier League and La Liga and you know Siri are you can see all the Premier League matches live on telly in American the way you can't in the UK and

Everybody plays it at school you know, it's it's it's becoming something where that grassroots.

You know engagement with the sport give it is got such a long way to go before it can compete with NBA in a basketball MLB baseball or NFL football makes a cannabis cigar shape shape with my hands, but it's this is a kind of a progress which has been driven by the rest of the world the game where you know, social media plays its part because you know American could think there's something going on that everybody else is really really excited ash, and how they have a team that doesn't completely search which is Which is a new thing now.

Yes well talking of which for us.

Let's focus on England for a bit.

I presume that America also has a commentary team that hasn't attracted quite the amount of the adverse publicity that as have in the UK at the BBC got 445 complaints over Phil Neville's commentary at the former Man United player was the butt of many Twitter timelines Danny Baker called him monotone comedy writer Simon Blackwell compare.

M28 dignitas sat nav what you made of the football coverage last five things interesting I think there's a it reminds me of when Otis did the Commonwealth Games the Channel 4 and the backlash for that I can ahead with the head of the Paralympics there of Ulysses around in the one of the one we love having a moan and kind of finding anything to moan about Around the World Cup is part of the fun.

I kind of think that people actually quite enjoy it when they can shout at referees and shout commentators and and you don't see them magic spray kind of going on the grass all of that sort of stuff is part of the whole makeup of watching football on TV and this is just part of it now especially with Twitter to know if you got to complain about something and it can't just always be about the performance of Wayne Rooney but I do think that there's an issue around nursery slopes and the fact that we seem to be getting slightly obsessed in a lot of areas including sports of finding big names.

So you can launch have a big press release and a big.

Campaign ahead of your coverage they look at all these great stars.

We've got doing although commentating and people write notes and get lots of newspaper column inches and then suddenly they go on there and then not actually that great because they don't simply don't have the experience.

I would be incredibly fearful of commentating was such a huge huge event regardless of if it's Commonwealth Games or the Olympics opening ceremony or in this instance England opening game it's it's just such a huge responsibility and a real skill and a real heart so it really doesn't surprise me when things don't quite go the way they should do because he's people are known for playing football the not known for chatting about it.

Yes, Emily I mean that's the flip side.

Isn't it of what you were saying in terms of Incredible dynafit, but cable networks have brought in terms of bringing football to a wider audience by buying up all the rights the flip side is that when you get a national broadcaster like the BBC so rarely actually broadcasting football matches, when they do it's going to be a really important one and they're trying out their Talent for the very first time in front of millions of

You was all armed with social media ready to slide off a commentators Manchester United the commentary team reflect back however, you do have Thierry Henry in his car to go which I did see passing through Heathrow on my way from Europe last week.

Not just been cardigan presumably in but the man himself completely different a conversation going on the back commentary on Twitter if you are middle-aged women no interest in Hammersmith Phil Neville it is very interested in both analysis and his knitwear as somebody said to me on Twitter he's so Sophisticated and handsome.

It makes me want to cry so I say you have to balance.

Patiently Moses Grace from I can only apologise for it.

So you have to counterbalance that with something you know a bit doll from Manchester United which seems to be always the way poor guy nobody batted like that on their first outing in the job has been said well.

You don't need to apologise for the objectification.

We're not with the Guardian anymore Emily we're going to be talking all about Gabby Logan next week on the media podcast timeline at Tenby has tweeted into ask isn't there another way of doing this other than a sofa full of old pro zyciem.

He's talking about the World Cup coverage not This podcast Faraz is there another way of doing this kind of coverage actually I can't think that I bizarrely decided to listen to the radio 1 cover is the head alternative commentary on on the Brazil game that went out the day before yesterday and I think that actually the BBC been quite clever and seeing how they can get lots of different audiences engaging with the content by doing alternative commentaries alongside getting you up and it's in there and and trying out some new ideas, so I actually think that they're doing something.

Everything's along the way, I must say it's easy to bash the BBC's coverage because we go there a public service broadcaster and that's the first thing you was pointing finger at I've actually been resound Lee disappointed with ITV's coverage.

I think that it's actually a little bit lazy and it could more work and creativity could have been done in in the studio work that I've done it.

Just feels like it's been found in a little bit why you say that although I didn't know that I wanted to see Adrian Chiles and Ian Wright's knees normally live in shorts on the beach broadcasting football commentary, but that's what you got to see the other day and in the middle of the day as well as a Big Sur been passed away by icb with no longer allowed to broadcast any Spotify terrible at it.

Is that not is that not happened? I think anyone allowed cheese anymore, but he still there moving on there are more changes at the Telegraph where several high-profile members of staff are leaving the paper at as it announced 14u editorial roles according to press Gazette on the way out at the editor of Telegraph blogs Damian Thompson and the former deputy editor and comment writer.

Benedict Brogan the new positions include an expansion to digital design and social media teams plus a breaking news team to get stories online faster Emily a focus on digital.

What do you make of it when I'm laid off all have chosen to go? Yes, you have to have a staff which is has facility with broadly 11 Michael digital journalism.

I'm not quite sure what lies behind Benedict Brogan leaving it can't be because you know they wanted to replace him with somebody on the breaking news team.

He's actually you know highly in a way the highly digital engaging on Twitter he does know the kind of Salou opinionated, but thoughtful journalism which actually does women wear on new media so again you know I come don't know whether he just decide.

It was time for him to go with there was something something more behind it seems to be eaten by a particular lost all them particularly as you're coming up to an election.

You really wouldn't want to let can go unless unless he wanted to go.

I'm still not sure what the Telegraph strategy is I'm not quite sure even what they said a voice and digital lizinna guardian has really clear voice mail has really clicked voice.

I'm hasnaa with the Times and Sunday Times because I seem really not because they're behind that be a walk, but the Telegraph used to be really a head in in all of this you know kind of the several years it had the first and then it has the largest and News website in the UK and they clearly still trying to get that back, but it still feels a little bit sore all over the shop to me off the records and put me off the record reports idea from inside the building speak to a kind of organised chaos and very low morale, but that's also often the case with.

Organisations there in the throat and it feels to me like it's probably losing ground a time where lot of online news outlets really getting my act together and powering ahead so you know I think this may be a salty taste of being way too late and possibly moving in the wrong direction, but let's see I'm going to be patient with this one.

Yeah, I wonder if it is to do with how many paper coffees they sell as well that Avenue a mentioning the male what they've done.

Very skillfully is create a website full of celebrity news and gossip which isn't the same content as in the newspaper and then with the Guardian you know circulation is in freefall.

Anyway and their audiences younger and more digitally engaged.

It makes sense to embrace them online.

I wonder if the problem for the Telegraph is actually they are still selling a lot of papers and so who are they trying to reach online for ASDA do you understand? Why they're doing this particular? When is Emily pointed out some of the people that are getting which up here actually are skillfully quite potential by definition is the possibility of h.

In the fast-paced world of digital advertising Oracle data cloud has built its Legacy on finding the signal through the noise on unlocking potential we bring together data and technology to help you better understand your audience where to best engage them and how to measure a tool to realise true potential Oracle data cloud where better outcomes begin visit Oracle data cloud., to learn more 5 out of 5 is a fantastic Smart TV decent value for money and the picture quality is incredible.

Not that I've actually watched it and they're even used it.

That's right.

This is a fake review and I can paint quite the picture for the right price of course wasting your time and your money.

I think review could cost you more than you think a witch membership.

Helps you avoid these lies search which for impartial product reviews which keep questioning as it is at the moment.

Miracles do go viral in the first place a long time ago when I was at school and actually Telegraph did have the biggest and best newspaper website and that's what you went to you when you were doing early research for course work when you're at school and Nick that seemed to fall on the way really really quickly and I think it was a shame that it kind of caught them by surprise and they haven't to stay in the strong strategy moving forward.

It's Tricky to say the reality is is it everybody needs to come up data space at least you've felt that it was starting to settle down as he say with the man in The Guardian getting themselves and identity in newspapers understanding what they were doing online but the Telegraph just seem to struggle slightly along with the Independent in figuring out.

Why why do I go to those sites? What are they offering me and I think that once they find their voice hopefully they'll start seeing a movement back into space work where they can be stronger but at the moment.

I must say I'm not entirely sure why you would pick the Telegraph is particularly, when it when I think the Telegraph content is rival buy things like the New York time.

Using Vox media and any other big you know the slate these of a big very considered new sites that you get from around the world which offering same sort of content and it is difficult to know how the Telegraph and compete in that space such a day either in the UK or or the us.

That has a really brilliant to cook coherent and thoughtful digital strategies been left of the lefties as it were nearing the mail is a different things may loses trousers is quite rightly has proceeded totally different Direction online there is really significant opportunity for the Telegraph but they just don't I'm sorry said I don't have the leadership United the cannot actually social leadership is difficult and in german, as there are few people who can do it at the moment because you need certain amount of experience and

So if you're if you're struggling with you know, what do you do with the Legacy organisation the same time it really divides your attention in a way that can be fatally damaged utilisations.

This is why digital what we called pure play the ground faster, but I wouldn't say you know I think it's really clear when they should fit.

It's just that they don't seem to have the leadership that can yet translate that into something which is really compelling this week now and Jeremy Paxman had his final appearance on Newsnight BBC2 long-running evening program has had it's fair share of problems in the past year or two that's proper likely isn't it? But it seemed like it had something to celebrate on Wednesday night was sort of I mean apparently Paxman of actually even asked for the celebrations be slightly toned down and not take up the whole show self-indulgent leave it.

There was the Tandem ride with Boris

Shiraz did you watch? What did you think it was a really great great moment of TV news is going to this weird comedy space.

Is it going to get a little bit wrong from time to time but the tone yesterday was absolutely right the news piece with Boris and if you can call and use pizza and Italian bikes.

I would actually showing Jeremy at its best where he knows was bear baiting did Boris and kind of you know kind of wrangling women having a bit of a play in a fight and it kind of felt really nice it felt like what you wanted from Jeremy even even a little bit of the camera and if you caught it with a cameo the weather at the end.

Just gone all those little nod they had about his career throughout the year might be coming with Michael Howard in microcosm with Jeremy not sure how good it was for Michael Howard if I bought it with them.

It was a really entertaining so I'm not sure if that's what Newsnight should be you know they think I know sometimes you need to make sure I got the balance right between being an accessible new show and making sure that they are actually breaking stories and doing the great German isn't it done for a number of times but I must say.

You went when they ended the show you did kind of feel a bit of where they go from here because without that voice because it the thing about the journey like something is that he actually he resisted a lot of that that change and now it will be asking is embracing that I wonder if it will lose a little bit of the magic of somebody sitting there, going on.

I'm not sure as the right direction and that kind of BBC sense of self deprecation where they were allowed to criticize them selves and and the you know kind of talk about themselves.

I think the real asset to the BBC and I hope they find somebody to replace Jeremy that can actually get a lot of that own right as well.

Well 3 year record high ratings for Newsnight still only just a Romanian people but pretty good for NewsNow off the back of that final appearance at I personally felt a bit like yeah.

This great anti-establishment figure and there was an element of what I might call the Ian Hislop problem there which is the in that final episode 3 chummy with Boris was me on a tandem bike actually wasn't showing himself to be part of the establishment after all maybe that is not the best signal 2.

Find on his final programme to be honest.

I just don't think he care that it was just having a laugh.

It was his last show I think that he let his guard down a little bit and you just had fun with the fact that he has this access and you can do these things in and get away with them and yeah.

Good luck to my thing well Emily the Guardian was speculating earlier this week that perhaps the maximum might go to Channel 4 news at the week before that there was a destined to be welcome on CNN by Michael Wolff of all people.

What do you think Emily where would you put Paxo next which is it has to be said no it's got rid of Piers Morgan what is completely sabino breathless coverage of whatever the big story of the day as I know I was thinking.

I think he's been right for that.

Hello good evening in expenses slot where they sent him to look at you know kind of investigate.

You know the world's Vineyards or you know there's that case of the emeritus professor of the BBC slot where you are.

Michael Palin allowed to travel around the world, but I kind of charming and assembling the fashion burning licence fee payers money as you go like a subway portrayal of cash, but nobody cares because you're saying that you're so beloved.

You're such a treasured part of the nation, but everybody was up tune in any way that im expecting to use a fisherman Disney you could I think so trout fishing in America with Jeremy Paxman app that finds a saying he's dumb he's done with the whole another set of fresh faced doll politicians dazzle deal with I think let him have some scenery and as a few 5-star hotel weather is an interesting thought I better question would be what it actually be on the BBC because for as I mean if he's talking to channel 4 on the reports are that they know they've had conversations and courts Heywood from the moment that you hear that he's up for grabs.

Obviously if he's talking to Channel 4.

What did the BBC actually miscalculate and the moment that he said he wanted to step down should have started talking to him about the next project not just continuing to do University Challenge because of the public do.

You like him what I would assume that they have been talking about talking to me that what you want to do next and he does feel like a BBC character.

I do do wonder no Channel 4 have Jon Snow and an actually David attfield by the good grandfather character that they have at 4 and and I kinda think if you are not too sure if they can cope with having two of them in the same sort of world personally.

I just wanna know when he's going to be on Strictly I mean that's got to be that's that's got to wear a sweepstakes alright, which year strictly's you going to hearing cos that's where you want it next episode on episode of BBC and finally before we do our tribute to Thriller in the media podcast studio here we going to talk about Wikipedia a group of internationally renowned PR firms got together last week and agreed to stop abusing Wikipedia for asthma.

What's this about? This is about it being a great story between what the internet for and what PR companies are for I think that this is fascinating though remember those of their story and a little while back when particularly online videos picking up about her astroturfing what you have lots of companies doing.

These websites that purported to be independent sites and then suddenly they're peeled they're actually had no big corporations behind them that were trying to put up the images of those Industries as a result and I can't I can't think that we'd Wikipedia it does feel like the honest truth on the internet and I think it's good that PR companies have gone actually this is only going to backfire of somebody recognises that we've messed around and you know that's when did looking Trust PR companies less so it seems sensible that they kinda stepped away from it, but I'll be honest if I was a PR company and Wikipedia was first launching the only makes complete sense that you would kind of getting there and kind of go right.

I need to protect my Brandon my my clients and now did it settle down.

I think they kinda go is clearly going to be a public backlash if we get caught doing this so we need to make sure that it's factual and let's step away from it.

All you have to do to be based on the pr press release.

Emily last week we were talking about journalism and how much PR has control over journalism these days, how much would you say in itself is based around a quick search on Wikipedia I mean it will begin to eat itself.

Wise can I meet you know they're actually no Wikipedia because it is a new type of public service organisation kept its integrity artichokes taste mean.

We all remember when it you're not coming.

I was still wouldn't completely rely on Wikipedia for absolutely everything but it's just in terms of timing in terms of character.

Is it is a reliable source what's interesting knows if you look at it around you never cheated big stories the most of the material that it relies on is exactly as you say from actually relatively narrow.

Set of sources which tend to be the big brands news provided in our customers providing whatever.

Surely, you know anyone with a brain tumour really need to come over not get together with agree that among yourselves.

Is that not just say absolutely obvious to anybody with two brain cells to rub together that you would be so much better not tampering with pages either of you know a brand that you're representing or indeed with those of your of your competitors.

May have to say that you know the fact that such as Wikipedia pages does show that they have been moved into the 21st century to some extent, but it's disgusting nobody wonder as well.

You know whether it's actually the executives in control of these PR companies that I personally editing the Wikipedia page of the weather.

This is actually you know your bright spark age 20 to 21 years old gets into the office and things like I'm going to do a good think I'm gonna show I know the 21st century and I'm going to start improving rpr.

Presents online I mean for as you must have seen that in offices as well.

Yeah, I think there's there's an

Need to make sure that you know you look good online now.

You know the whole story around Google allowing you to take down your your personal profiles and I cannot delete your history and and there's there's a lot chatting about companies going to be allowed to do that moving forward.

I mean obviously is individuals.

We're always taught that we need to audit ourselves as a socially and I think it's only intelligent that companies do the same thing as well, so it doesn't surprise me that this is something that PR companies would be tempted to do but like I said I think that the requirement things like Wikipedia and even read it and an even Twitter for that that that matter of when you can't say things and you get caught out saying things the backlash of that you're going to be amplified to such a higher rate than actually trying to do something is fit a fairly relatively small just gonna give yourself a little bit of a bump and you have to be very careful make sure that the decisions that you're making online in those spaces are the right decisions otherwise it's just going to backfire on you and the other thing about Wikipedia of course.

Is it sir crowdfunded on that note it's just time to finish this week's Media podcast with.

Media quiz at this week's the game is who am I at the beginning of an entry from Wikipedia you tell me who it is I'm describing and then what new story connect to it as I format doesn't for ASDA's format been registered GoGo picture to talk back immediately best of three the winner gets a cream egg here's the first I am a BBC children's TV series targeted at preschool viewers and produce from March 1997 to January 2001.

I was created by Ann Wood CBE and Andrew Davenport who wrote each of my 365 episodes festivals in that's an inaccurate Teletubbies interested now.

It's now 2014 must be produced series it not corrected BBC having fat commission 60 new episodes to go with the original 365.

If you only have one for every day of the year.

Why do you need another 60 kiss kiss fresh content always a good thing or merchandising is also an attractive proposition.

That's what I should do I should think of the S6 teletubby, will you download working diversity? You should talk to him about what exactly they need to do with VI teletubby not an absolutely not gonna suggest they have a brown telephone number to I am an online social networking service.

I'm sensing that Emily might get this one quicker my name comes from a colloquialism for the Directory given to students at some American universities.

I was founded on February 4th 2004 by Mark Zuckerberg I think you can probably buzzing at this point Cisco in the series of conferences.

I have no idea give me a clue clue would be for me to go entirely silent now and not give you any feedback at all went down half an hour direct there was an outage for 20 minutes on Thursday morning the first time it has done so since 2010.

Not that I noticed that's working so.

Yes, yeah, but absolutely this is the west coast of America is 11:30 in the morning.

I am honestly you are in San Francisco I'd imagine that would be headline news there.

When it when you wake up now or something that you know there's been no no headlines here about a 20-minute outage in the middle of the night Facebook expertise covering their by Emily Bell and finally number 3 who are my buzzing if you know the answer you've got what I need I am a collection of computer hackers who support to the government of Syrian president Bashar al-Assad using denial-of-service attacks defacement and other methods it mainly targets political opposition groups and western websites including news organisations and humoral Emily correct.

Do you know what they've been up to this week who they've been attacking?

Symmetry to say that I'm gonna steal this one's well for us, because it was it was very regular the websites of the sun and the times at someone that basis for as you win the creme egg congratulations.

Yes, thanks do Emily Bell and Faraz Osman next week will be joined by Matt Deegan of folder media and Lisa Campbell of the Edinburgh TV festival if you have any questions for them get in touch via our Twitter feed at the media podcast at my name is Ollie man.

I'm at all you man on Twitter by the way for as if Nando's want to get in touch about that black card at the producer was Matt Hill the three more shows to go until we run out of doing this before so keep pledging goodbye potential by definition is the possibility of achieving more in.

Fast-paced world of digital advertising Oracle data cloud has built its Legacy on finding the signal through the noise on unlocking potential we bring together data and technology to help you better understand your audience where to best engage them and how to measure a tool to realise true potential Oracle data cloud where better outcomes begin visit Oracle data cloud., to learn more.